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Scandalous ways ICOs scam you and counter measures

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ICOs scam

Crypto space is filled with many intelligent ideas. Sadly, some of that intelligence is being used to scam people lately in a scandalous way.

We have compiled ways you could become a victim of an ICO scam. We will not stop there, will also provide you countermeasures to avoid being a victim yourself.

Using faces of people that never agreed to be on board

The Internet is a vast place.

How do you know if someone is using your pictures, credentials, and fame to dupe people?
It is very difficult unless someone warns you.

We personally faced this issue on Fiverr where someone was using an Australian journalist’s picture and credentials to sell services on Fiverr. When we reached out to the journalist to confirm the identity – our suspicions turned out to be true. The real author eventually lodged a complaint with Fiverr who promptly shut down the account. This freelance scam only effects those who directly contact the person.


ICOs are a different story. 

Hundreds and thousands of people get duped and it gives ammunition to the authorities to take complete control of this decentralization movement.

We have been noticing many cases where popular social figure names are used to create hype of an ICO and it was eventually realized that the person was not even aware of their name and image being used in raising money.

Counter measure: See if the pictures are identical to the individual’s social profile. If they are chances are it’s a scam. Generally, whenever an ICO manages to bring people on board – they take profile shots using their own merchandise (which is easy to photoshop as well) – however, it is always a good measure to see person’s personal social media feed to see if they disclosed anything about the project.

SEC approved, NOT

If you think people are the only victims of false claims – you are mistaken.  Even SEC is not spared. SECs name was used to lure investors under false pretense.  Recently SEC had to procure an emergency halt against Blockvest LLC. What Blockvest did is fill out an application with SEC stating that they ‘will not disclose how much they will raise’ and they ticked a box stating that they are not a security.

You can view the application here.

Essentially, anyone can fill this information – that doesn’t translate to ‘approval’.   It’s like sending in an application to Harvard and calling yourself a Harvard graduate.

Counter measure: Look for documents that prove the claims. Reach out to respective authorities in your country to confirm the authenticity of the claim.

We have partnered with everyone, even BMW, why not!

In a lawsuit against Titanium’s CEO, SEC listed all the fraudulent claims that the company made about being partnered with big brand name companies including Boeing, Accenture, and Paypal.

We fell for this scam ourselves.

Why not, Titanium boasted itself to be the first company to be BBB approved and even got verified by one of the top companies in the US.  To add to this, the list of companies and Michael’s personal profile was more than what Crypto space had seen earlier.

In another event, CarVertical claimed that it partnered with BMW. Later, BMW had to release a statement that they have not partnered with CarVertical.

Counter measure: When in doubt, tweet or message the companies with which these ICOs claim to have partnership or association.

Boasted Experience without a trail

In crypto space, the team is everything.

One person built Bitcoin that is now worth billions of dollars and may forever change how we transact in the future

Few folks built Ethereum that could revolutionize the way we enter into contracts.

So, yes, team’s experience and expertise is everything in this space.

This is precisely why lot of companies inflate their team’s experience or add fake profiles to create hype around their project.  Ultimately, they only need to raise quick buck and don’t need lot of people to fall for it.

Counter measure: Always look for LinkedIn profiles.  Check the age of social media.  Send a note to the ‘real’ person to see if they are ‘truly’ associated.


Selfies are a means too

In one of the tweets Changpeng Zhao of Binance had to warn people who were trying to use a selfie with him to promote an ICO.

This happened with Vitalik Buterin as well where people used selfies with him from his non-popular days to boast the direct association with Vitalik to raise funds.

Counter measure: This one is easy – tag the person in the same thread and ask ‘is this true?’. Most times people respond if the claims are an attempt to fraud.

Freebies, a tell tell sign of a scam!

How do you lure gullible ICO investors into investing as quickly as possible?

Set up a multi-level sale structure. Something like this:

First 1000 investors get 100% bonus
Next 1000 investors get 50% bonus
Everyone else gets 0% bonus
Did you see what I did there?

If I manage to create a decent website, add a few fake profiles, post some made up addresses – that will be enough to convince people to get duped without verifying because people will have their eyes on the freebies.

Even if the company only manages to raise money from first 1000 investors who fall for 100% bonus – that is a fantastic yield for a scam.

Scammers will just rinse and repeat, until we learn.

Counter measure: Generally, most genuine projects do not need to offer any bonuses.  Do your due diligence on the company and team.   When in doubt, wait for the ICO to end, see if they actually do something in the real world before deciding to invest.  Its better to pay premium after they prove their worth than to get duped entirely by falling for freebies!

No physical office? Stay away

It is easy to rent a temporary work space these days.  You can even customize it with your company name, logos.  It doesn’t cost much compared to entering into a long-term lease.

If your ICO claims to have an office space in prime location – it always pays to find out if it is true.

If the company entered into a lease – it generally conveys some confidence in the intent.  However, if they falsely claim a temporary office to be their headquarters or something alike – be wary.

If the ICO doesn’t have any physical location including a registered address – that is your queue to stay away.

Counter measure: Wherever possible, have someone check out the address.  Thanks to social media and fellow ‘potential’ investors on reddit, twitter, slack, telegram – this can be accomplished without having to travel to the ICO country

Other ways to scam

There are other ways investors could get scammed during ICOs, including:

  • Email hacks – email list of the ICO participants gets hacked and an invitation to participate in a limited time sale is sent out. Genuine projects generally do not change their timeline.

Countermeasure: Reach out to official twitter or email to confirm before investing

Website/Telegram/Slack channel hacks – website, telegram and/or slack channels could get compromised and a wallet address floats around for people to participate in ICO ahead of the crowd. Because this is floating in official channels – its easy to fall prey to this scam.

Countermeasure: reach out to the core team/administrators via other channels like twitter or facebook or email

Being aware if the first step to being safe. Investigate before investing.

Thank you for reading this article.

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CryptoSpace

Chasing the Micro Cap Crypto Gems #4 – Skrumble Protocol – Why We Changed Our View On This?

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Micro Cap crypto Gems

The tricky thing about finding micro-cap gems is that we have to find something that fits our crypto framework criteria and still be under $10 Million in the market cap.   

The project that we picked today had a few flags while we were researching and we promptly reached out to the team to clarify.   

You will see our initial views/opinions based on publicly available information and the response from the company.

What is Skrumble Network?

What is Skrumble NetworkThe core concept behind Skrumble Network is that when data is stored in one centralized location (like a Server) it poses the greatest security when it gets hacked.

However, if your data is fragmented and stored on decentralized servers, even that particular decentralized server gets hacked, your data is still secured because the fragmented piece that got hacked is usually incomprehensible.

Skrumble Network helps decentralize the communication protocol by using Blockchain technology.

Skrumble Network helps facilitate File transfers, secure messaging, Video streaming and calling.

how Skrumble network works

Whitepaper describes: “Skrumble Network is a secure, communication-centric blockchain, decentralized communication application and a communication layer for developers to add into any application. With no middle entity or centralized server host in between to censor, block or manipulate any data, Skrumble Network will enable open, global private communication and transactions that are truly community owned and operated.”

One of the distinguishing factors about this project was that it was initially developed with an established company behind this crypto that has been in the business for more than half-a-decade and they know how to deliver a product that is used in the real business world.

Applying our framework

As is our custom, let’s apply the CryptoTapas framework around this project.

Problem

The security around our communications is as old of an issue as the internet itself.

This concern has become more pronounced in the recent years with the news of hacks and breach of confidentiality, and utter disregard for privacy.

Now that COVID has completely changed the way we work (especially working from home), the security around communications is now taking the spotlight again.

If Skrumble Network addresses this issue in a novel, scalable and easy to implement way – it might have a great chance at this massive problem.

Team

Eric Lifson seems to be working on Skrumble Network for over 3 years now, and he was quite accommodative when we reached out to him with questions. 

When we looked at the team page on the Skrumble’s website, with the exception of three members, everyone who is listed on their team’s page is no longer with the company (some since July 2019) and this disappoints us that they have not updated their own team’s profile.

Skrumble Network team

More importantly, if everyone jumped the ship, who is behind the project now?

The flagship app on Skrumble Protocol, GetAlly, shows the team members that are also associated with Skrumble Protocol, however, most of these team members are no longer with Skrumble.

Question for Skrumble Team: Who is working on this project? What is the current team structure?  

[Update: The project informed us that all these people have at one point worked on the project. While the team has downsized to a team of about 6 core people, SKM has a strong brand and past and present members prefer to maintain recognition of their achievements. Moreover, several are still contributing, just not on a full-time basis. Any who do not, the team offers to remove them at any time. This is now more in line with how ongoing DAOs (Decentralized Autonomous Organizations) seem to be operating.]

Partnerships

Skrumble Network’s Ally dApp claims to have a 150K user base.  They also teased about the upcoming partnership to take the DeFi initiative forward.

We actually like the advisor profile associated with the Skrumble Network project one of whom is Anthony Di Iorio, co-founder of Ethereum.

Apart from Anthony, Skrumble has Jeff Pulver who is the co-founder of $3 Billion communication company, Vonage.

That is quite a respectable name association with Skrumble.

Question for Skrumble team: Have there been any changes in the Advisor group (similar to team changes?).

[Update: No. We also still Jin Tu – former CTO of Aion, OAN boardmember and Cofounder of Axis DeFi, who is an Expert Blockchain Architect. 

Redouane Elkamhi,
PhD, Associate Professor at Rotman
Leader in Fintech & Blockchain at the University of Toronto 

Kevin Hsu,
Founder Partner at BlockVC
Investor in Ontology, RSK & QTUM 

Jiangang Wu, PhD
Co-Founder of Fusion
Professor of Finance & Blockchain Economics at Shanghai University] 

Addressable market size

Secured communications, whether it is simple file sharing service or video streaming or chatting is a huge market.

It has only exploded in value in the past few months when people were forced to communicate over the internet instead of in-person meetings.

This trend will only become the norm as the internet becomes more accessible (Elon’s Starlink reality) and companies start restricting travel.

File transfers, messaging, video streaming and calling verticals market size is in $100s of Billions, if not trillions.

Revenue model

Question for Skrumble team: How does Skrumble Network generate revenue?

[Update: The core problem for SKM has actually been the volatility of the utility token model in general. We will address this in more detail later.]

DeFi + Communication?

Skrumble Network’s official blog was silent since October of 2019, although remained very active on Telegram, and resurfaced with an announcement that Skrumble Network is going DeFi. 

The announcement about a partnership with Juggernaut reads “unique custom financial modelling and DeFi deployment, it can enable token projects to have real, sustainable, and modular business models built around their utility model.”

Is this another attempt to exploit the market craze around DeFi?

We asked the team this question directly.

Skrumble Network Roadmap

Question for Skrumble Network Team: What drove this decision to look at DeFi and what unique attributes do you think will help Skrumble succeed in this space? 

How does this Juggernaut help Skrumble’s vision?

[Update: Really, we see two sustainable business models so far in the space – 

  1.     platform tokens (for exchanges) with only room for a few like Huobi or Binance
  2.     DeFi due to the collective staking, lockup and general collateralization of new directions and ability to focus on new industries.

A two-token solution is the only way to do something meaningful and sustainable in my opinion with a utility token. One for utility and one for profit sharing. They are missing the sustainable business model. They don’t have enough usage to reach a critical mass and the DeFi synthetic at least has a chance to have something closer a traditional ‘share’ balanced approach. 

Most proof of stake with inflation models will reach a point where one has to ask where any utility token can be able to sustain beyond initial interest 

This is why we must change the game. 

Basing anything on a pure utility token that fluctuates is basically unsustainable. This is because when people are in the money they just leave to the next hot project. People who operate in DAOs want something more stable to base their livelihoods on. They want something closer to USD that can be more stable and scalable. 

This is an overview of how we see DeFi becoming a crucial component going forward:https://medium.com/juggernaut-defi/skm-partners-with-jgn-to-develop-first-defi-communication-network-20ba9a3ccf38 

What do we like about Skrumble?

We like the fact that Skrumble Technologies has been a technology company since 2014 and it has leveraged some technology and strategic guidance from them in their initial inception.  It has real business with actual clients in the market.  How many of the 6500 cryptos can claim that? 

Additionally, the company has patents to its name and helps them deploy proprietary solutions in the market. 

In addition, we like that the co-founder is quite active in working on building Skrumble Network up. 

You can go to the Telegram and see him responding to the questions posed by the community. 

When we reached out to Eric, he provided a quick ‘highlight’ of Skrumble for someone who is new to the project, we have reproduced what Eric shared with us below (we have not independently verified this information): 

Skrumble Network is reshaping freedom of speech and data privacy with a communication-centric blockchain due to our unique PoA architecture, formidable global community, robust proprietary chain, accomplished advisors, and top-tier exchanges. 

🤝PoA consensus model: Aligning incentives and encouraging active community participation

💪Innovative chain and base layer: Enabling other dApps to be built on top of Skrumble Network. First dApp- Ally already has 150k+ users with more coming soon

🙋🏻‍♂️Industry-leading advisors: Including Anthony Di Iorio (Co-Founder of Ethereum) and Jeff Pulver (Co-Founder of $3B Vonage), Jin Tu (CTO of Aion), Redouane Elkamhi, PhD (Lead of Fintech & Blockchain at the University of Toronto), Kevin Hsu (Partner, BlockVC)

🥇Trusted and premier exchanges. Won Huobi FastTrack vote last week with over 40 million votes. Counting Gate.io, Huobi Global, Bittrex, LBank, Coinbene etc as our exchange partners

🎖Ranked by ICO Drops for both top 5 global community and ROI in Q22018

🗳Won Huobi FastTrack with 40M+ votes on June 27 19

👑Massive dApp ecosystem coming soon with innovative token economic details

🦁DeFi component / partnership incoming 

Things to consider

Apart from the general risk that is inherent with the crypto space, consider the following when you DYOR on Skrumble Network. 

Competition

Few blockchain/crypto companies have tried to take a stab at the ‘secured communication’ aspect using blockchain. 

We have not yet heard the great success story in this space. 

This is good news and not so at the same time. 

It is good news because Skrumble Network could be THE project that penetrates the ‘success resistance’ in space. 

It is not so good news because the same reasons that lead to the failure of previous projects could plague Skrumble Network. 

Team changes

Exodus of team members from the Skrumble Network is a point of concern for us.  We are going to update this section with the response from the Skrumble Network team (without removing this concern from here). [Update: It seems that several are still involved in a part time basis, and they claim to have streamlined their operation. They are also actively working with the Juggernaut (JGN) team to implement the DeFi rewards system. For more details on JGN please see here: https://jgndefi.com/ 

Token supply

While the market cap is what matters the most in terms of the potential multiples, crypto space seems to be very touchy about the token supply. 

Token supply on Skrumble Network (SKM) is 1.5 Billion and might be looked at as quite high.

All tokens have been released to the market. In this space, the actual token supply amounts are becoming far less important. This was a pretty standard number in 2018 and was advised to the team. 

Team is expected to release more token utility and use cases as per the information alluded to by Eric and depending on the future use cases the market might respond positively. 

Moving to a more stable way of incentivizing operators may innovate the DeFI space beyond pure finance and into other industries as we rediscover how we share and perceive value. 

This is an overview of how we see DeFi becoming a crucial component going forward: https://medium.com/juggernaut-defi/skm-partners-with-jgn-to-develop-first-defi-communication-network-20ba9a3ccf38   

Conclusion

Our first impression is that Skrumble Network looks like a project with a lot of potential.  However, potential means nothing until it is ‘realized’. 

Will Skrumble Network realize its potential?  We do not know and that is the dilemma we have to ‘risk’ when dealing with micro-cap gems.

Thank you for reading and sharing this article. We appreciate you.

Stay safe and healthy!

Top 5 Cryptocurrencies 2020

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IMPORTANT DISCLAIMER

Everything in this article is an opinion, not an advice of any kind. This material has been prepared for general informational purposes only and it is not intended to be relied upon as accounting, tax, investment, legal or other professional advice. Please consult with a professional for specific advice.

We do not endorse or guarantee the accuracy of the information and claims made.

All product and company names are trademarks™ or registered® trademarks of their respective holders. Use of them does not imply any affiliation with or endorsement by them.

 

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5 questions we want XRP army to answer!

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xrp investing news

What follows is our opinion.  

Let’s not be hostile.  

Top 5 Cryptocurrencies 2020

We are simply posing some questions based on the information we came across and our own limited interpretation. 

It is quite possible that the sources we are referring to are at fault or our interpretation is. Either way, just answer these questions for us so that we can learn new things about XRP that we did not know.

Our readers know that we have been anti-XRP for a long time. We got trolled, mocked and called ignorant. Well, to each their own.

Our questions to the entire XRP army are simple, here they are:

Question 1: If crypto was to replace (or at least reshape) the entire banking business then what does a token whose sole business model is based on ‘accommodating’ banks have any future?

To put differently, when the world starts conducting commerce via text messages why do we need banks and Ripple which wants to serve banks?

Our basis for this question: 

In the future when we will start doing business with each other over text messages, wallets and email signatures, why do we need a payment gateway from Ripple?

We know that WeChat payment enables users to transact over chat.  Other companies are trying to catch up with this (primarily why Facebook was looking at creating its own currency, Libra).

However, once we have a digital dollar, we do not even need an outside stablecoin since one could, in theory, use the digital dollar directly.                  

Question 2: Why do you have to pay businesses to use XRP if it is so superior?

Our basis for this question: 

Financial Times reported that Ripple paid Moneygram to use Ripple technology.

Here is a direct quote:

It turns out Ripple has been paying a significant amount of subsidies cash to MoneyGram’s business since buying into the company in June. In the third and fourth quarter alone the Ripple benefits amounted to $11.3m.

What’s more, until a consultation with the SEC**, MoneyGram had been more than happy to book these cash flows as revenues. Due to the SEC guidance, however, it has now had to restate fourth-quarter guidance to account for Ripple payments as “contra expenses”.

XRP Twitter

Question 3: What is Ripple’s revenue worth without the ‘selling’ XRP?

Our basis for this question: 

The question seems to be answered by the XRP’s CEO himself. Here is an excerpt:

Asked if XRP was keeping everything cash flow positive at Ripple Labs, Mr Garlinghouse answered: “Well XRP is one source. I don’t know how to answer that because if you took away our software revenues, that would make us less profitable. If you took away all our XRP, that makes us less profitable. So I don’t think about it as one thing.” 

He clarified later: “We would not be profitable or cash flow positive [without selling XRP], I think I’ve said that. We have now.”

In our opinion, we think that the only reason Ripple (XRP) is even operational is because of the billions upon billions of XRP tokens that they keep dumping on the unassuming investors.  

Is this a wrong assumption?

Question 4: If Ripple does not need XRP, why is XRP needed?

Our basis for this question: 

This is based on our understanding that Ripple’s technology can be used by the businesses without having to use XRP.  It is recommended but not ‘required’.

Is this accurate?

Ripple’s solutions can work without XRP (its native token).  So, if XRP is not a utility token in strict sense, how are its creators able to mint and sell them at will without tripping any security laws?

Question 5: If Ripple [XRP] is to act as the ‘stable’ value while the transactions take place on Ripple network, why should anyone trust XRP which is backed by nothing instead of stablecoins like USDC that are backed by real world assets?

Our basis for this question: 

We would personally trust USDC more or even Facebook’s Libra rather than XRP which is backed by nada.

This is what Demelza’s opinion was during our interview:

“The main point is that if XRP were able to back their currency with financial assets and stabilize the purchasing power of the currency, then that would mean XRP coins should have no price appreciation. In fact, only the equity shares of Ripple Labs would profit from XRP’s adoption as a global reserve currency. But Ripple Labs is a privately held company. After fully understanding what XRP is, one realizes that XRP’s investment pitch does not make sense at all.”

Conclusion

We are trying to convince ourselves as to why we need Ripple in the crypto space if:

  • Future of payments is going to be ‘self-bank’ & over the chat
  • There are better stablecoins in the market 
  • Ripple itself as a technology doesn’t need its own native token, XRP

For this very reason, our opinion is that the money will flow out of XRP and the creators will keep dumping their bags into the market until the market can no longer absorb it and then it will be ‘lights out’.

We await for the XRP army to provide us insights that we did not know and our opinion changes…

Thank you for reading and sharing this article. We appreciate you.

Stay safe and healthy!

Top 5 Cryptocurrencies 2020

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IMPORTANT DISCLAIMER

Everything in this article is an opinion, not an advice of any kind. This material has been prepared for general informational purposes only and it is not intended to be relied upon as accounting, tax, investment, legal or other professional advice. Please consult with a professional for specific advice.

We do not endorse or guarantee the accuracy of the information and claims made.

All product and company names are trademarks™ or registered® trademarks of their respective holders. Use of them does not imply any affiliation with or endorsement by them.

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DeFi is Not the Holy Grail of Crypto, Here is Why

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Defi Yfi

DeFi has been making millionaires overnight and turning millionaires broke at the same speed.

Those who are on the bandwagon are rejoicing and those who either missed out or got burned by one of the fake projects are yelling ‘Scam’ at DeFi.

Top 5 Cryptocurrencies 2020

Our views are a bit different on the subject.

We do think DeFi is going to be a successful vertical among the blockchain (and crypto) solutions.

It will not be THE holy grail for the redemption of crypto status though.

Supply Chain, Crypto Lending, Insurance, Financial Services, Accounting, Identity, and many more verticals will collectively take blockchain and crypto to the masses.

Shifting our focus back on DeFi, here are some of our thoughts on the current state of DeFi. We do appreciate you dropping any insights you have that we might have missed.

DeFi is not a ponzi, here is why

If the DeFi project you are eyeing meets the following conditions, it is not a ponzi:

  • Audited code: Is the code on which DeFi runs is audited by reputable blockchain auditors? 
  • Reliable team: Who is behind the project? Do they have the know-how? Do they have a history of running scams or leading successful projects? 
  • Actual (sustainable) revenue model: What is the revenue model?  Is it too ‘scammy’ sounding or is it based on sound mathematical (and algorithmic) models?
  • No lock-in periods: Is it easy to get in and out of the platform without any restrictions or lock-in periods?

If you answered yes to ALL of these questions then there is a 100% certainty that the DeFi you are dealing with is not a ponzi (or scam).

However, a caveat is due here.  

Just because the project is not a ponzi doesn’t guarantee its success. Lot of well intentioned companies fail, that’s just the nature of business.

So, do not be one of those guys who sells their home to invest in crypto or DeFi (and that itself is not advice, just an opinion).

If you don’t want to hear it from us, listen to what Yearn Finance creator has to say about DeFi tokens (not all, obviously) having ZERO value.

Source: Crypto Culture

DeFi on Ethereum is not sustainable, here is why

Ethereum DefiMost, if not all, DeFi projects that are making the news today are on Ethereum. 

Ethereum is not a reliable blockchain when it is overloaded.  It gets choked and crashes.  

People are already complaining about exorbitant fees on the network due to the DeFi craze.  

DeFi itself as a crypto vertical is quite new and we are sure there are going to be a lot of ‘killer apps’ that will show up on the scene.

We are currently looking at the DeFi solutions that are being built on other blockchain networks (subscribe for free to know when we post that article).

PolkaDOT is not the end all be all, here is why

Polkadot Defi EcosystemMany are turning to the DOT as the next big thing after Ethereum.

It may very well be.

However, it has not had the chance to prove itself, not yet.

Ethereum’s resilience (or lack thereof) was revealed only during the ICO craze (and then later during CryptoKitties debacle).

What monsters lie in the DOT’s belly?  We don’t know and we would be weary of anyone who claims to know with certainty.

Other things to consider

Entire DeFi space is pretty new and we do not know what we do not know about potential vulnerabilities.

While this is true of Bitcoin itself, Bitcoin has withstood assault for over a decade and still stands stronger.  

Same cannot be said about DeFi.  

Can you imagine someone investing their life-savings into DeFi only to have funds taken because of a bug in the code?

Needless to say, many folks are exploiting the looping system in the DeFi where they take loan against their deposit then lend it back to the platform to take another loan against their deposit, and ad infinitum.

This is causing the DeFi systems to show more liquidity than what truly is.

Conclusion

We think DeFi is an exciting development, however, we still put it alongside ICO craziness for now.

When this space matures and we see reliable solutions emerge – DeFi has the potential to drive a trillion dollar vertical on its own.  

That is just the potential, all the trials and tribulations that we have to go through to get there is going to be one hell of a ride.  

So buckle up and enjoy (and please do not lose your shirts on the ride)!

Thank you for reading and sharing this article. We appreciate you.

Stay safe and healthy!

Top 5 Cryptocurrencies 2020

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IMPORTANT DISCLAIMER

Everything in this article is an opinion, not an advice of any kind. This material has been prepared for general informational purposes only and it is not intended to be relied upon as accounting, tax, investment, legal or other professional advice. Please consult with a professional for specific advice.

We do not endorse or guarantee the accuracy of the information and claims made.

All product and company names are trademarks™ or registered® trademarks of their respective holders. Use of them does not imply any affiliation with or endorsement by them.

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